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Showing posts with label proton suprima s. Show all posts
Showing posts with label proton suprima s. Show all posts

Thursday, November 20, 2014

Ramblings about Lotus Cars, the terrible image that Proton Cars have and what needs to be done.

7:39 AM 0
Lotus Suprima S - Imagine the above with massive arches, 18inch wheels, vented bonnet, whale-tail rear spoiler and at least 200bhp. And a PROPER Lotus badge instead of that corny R3 one......Would a true enthusiast buy it for RM105,000? I believe so.

I had been doing some reading up on Lotus Cars recently. Lotus Cars is owned by DRB-Hicom through Proton, the Malaysian car company. Both car companies are actually in a bit of trouble owning to low sales volumes with Proton being second in the Malaysian passenger vehicle sales charts for the past two years or so. Assembler and re-badge experts Perodua have taken over the top spot in passenger car sales in Malaysia and its no question that Malaysians seem to like the brand more these days. Tell me how many of the newly launched Proton Iriz (which in 1.6liter form is not too bad) you see on the roads today compared to the newly launched Perodua Axia (which is the best value for money car you can buy these days with the puny Ringgit). Couple this with the fact that Malaysian banks seem to be tightening down on car loans also do not auger well with Proton who according to my sources have about 50% of customer car loan applications rejected or turned down. Not the fault of Proton, but this bites nonetheless.



Anyway, Lotus is slightly better. By slightly better this means selling slightly more than 1,000 cars for the first half of this year. 1,114 units to be exact and far better than the 749 units sold during the same period last year. Of course this is a blip in Proton's scale of things but not to a specialty manufacturer like Lotus. Of course, one has to remember the ex-CEO Dany Bahar's plan to take Proton to the stratosphere. That called for six different sports cars at one go and most 'realists' would say that how the heck can Lotus come up with that on a limited amout of funds (they are not Ferrari, Porsche or even Mercedes Benz). Then when you start calculating, Lotus would need to sell 50,000 units a year in order for such a number of sports cars to be realised before they would have any reasonable economics of scale. I suppose the chap just wanted the free private jets to and from F1 races as well as the free housing and other fringe benefits of being CEO.

Lotus these days are sensible. I read the recent Autocar article about the interview it conducted with current CEO Jean Mark-Gales. In it he mentioned that Lotus is looking at a sensible figure of 10,000 cars yearly if it follows the Porsche business plan and starts building four-door cars. It does make sense as the Panamera and the Cayenne sells like crazy. In the article it also mentioned that Lotus may be looking at a SUV for the South-East Asian market where demand is at its greatest. S.E.A means Malaysia, no doubt. So I can safely say that we're going to see a Lotus SUV soon. I also have a hunch that Proton may be in collaboration too. But I suppose this is a few years away and in the meantime, Proton is bleeding.

I've always thought that Proton isn't utilising Lotus the way it should or could for the Malaysian market. Most of us regular Joes are not feeling the fruits of such a tie-up. Lotus cars is actually one heck of a company. The heritage the brand has is almost better than some out of the blue luxury brand created by the Japanese like Lexus or Infiniti. Lotus has real F1 heritage, road racing heritage, proper sports car heritage and don't forget, the James Bond link too. So what have most Malaysians got out of the deal? A 'Tuned by Lotus' badge on the rump of the Proton Satria GTI and the Suprima S at the most. Yes there was some suspension tuning done by the chaps at Hethel but I can bet you it was tiny. I remember being in a Chevrolet Optra which had suspension tuning by Lotus and it rode better than the claimed to be tuned by Lotus Proton Waja. Proton were cheapskates in my opinion. Not enough of Lotus in their cars.

Of course then they did come up with a RM120,000 Lotus Satria Neo which actually had the privilege of being badged a Lotus instead of a Proton. In fact the car is registered with the JPJ as a Lotus. Enough said. But the thing about that car was that it was based on a car that couldnt fit tall people, had stupid ergonomics, cheapo plastic and a serious lack of power for something to be sold in the mid-2000s onwards.

What needs to be done to boost the image if not the sales for Proton (and to some part Lotus) is this.......

In order to increase the image of Proton and Lotus to a point a new collaboration based on a Proton should be done for the Malaysian market only. Why so? This is just a stop gap car for Lotus cars but an image builder for Proton. You see, I remember discussing the point of Proton coming up with a new car brand like Lexus or Infiniti so that Proton can sell cars away from the stigma that affects its cars.

Actually the first thing is to actually get the cars built right in the first place but these days, with a serious lack of image, even a well built Proton will not make sales numbers. So Proton needs a better image or brand and this is where Lotus comes in.

What they need to do is forget about all that racing car nonsense that lightness is the only thing that needs to be added to Lotus cars. It works in Britain and Europe where cars aren't heavily taxed. Have you ever tried getting into an entry level Lotus Elise or Exige if you are a chubby bloke? You can't unless you are a flexible chubby bloke. I tried a couple of times and I usually sprain something or tear my pants. The only Lotus from the current line-up that fits me well is the Evora and it is the same price as a Porsche Cayman. And then when you sit inside a Cayman after an Evora you think that the interior of the Cayman came from heaven whereas the interior of the Evora was built by the foreign worker employed to build a public toilet. I mean honestly, we Asians have to spend an obscene amount of money to buy a sports car and we do not want to be a contortionist or find ourselves in a budget hotel instead of a room in the Hilton. And this is why Lotus fails to sell here in Malaysia, Singapore and elsewhere around Asia. We'd rather buy luxury over lightness if it costs over RM250,000. Don't tell me I am wrong because I am not. So Lotus should forget most of the lightness part in some of its cars in order to gain more sales. Really.

So what we need is a luxury Lotus with the help of Proton or vice versa. This will boost sales and image of both. Lotus Proton needs a Malaysia only car that is luxurious, fast enough and priced reasonably enough. Lightness need not be a key figure here as if we take out a few pages from Lotus' recent history, it can be done.


I remember casting my eyes on something called the Lotus Carlton in the mid 1990s here in Kuala Lumpur. The 1990-1992 Lotus Carlton or in mainland Europe, the Lotus Omega and sometimes called the Vauxhall Lotus Carlton in the UK was an Opel Omega / Vauxhall Carlton upgraded by Lotus Cars to be a 177mph (285km/h) sports sedan with a 0-100kmh time of around 5.2 seconds. It had a 3.6liter turbocharged engine pumping out 377bhp and over 568Nm torque. It is considered a proper Lotus and was given a type designation — Type 104. The external differences were minimal with the addition of a rear spoiler, vents on the bonnet, Lotus badges on the front wings and bootlid, a bodykit and considerably wider wheel arches distinguishing it from a standard Carlton (shown below). Note that there wasn't an ounce of 'lightness' built into that Opel/Vauxhall. Lotus did up the engine, suspension and some bodywork. What lightness? It was a bahn-stormer and it was properly fast for its day and even to this day.


Prior to this there was a 'Hot  Hatch' that used the Lotus name too. It was the Talbot Sunbeam Lotus which was produced for about two years or so from 1979 to 1981. Based on the Chrysler Sunbeam compact hatchback, it had a 150bhp /203Nm 2.2 liter 4 cylinder engine powering the rear wheels (the Sunbeam was a rwd car) and was used in rallys of the period. It was actually quite good and actually won the manufacturer's title in the WRC for Talbot. What that car basically was are larger wheels and tyres, a larger engine, transmission and  stiffer suspension compared to the regular Sunbeam. Again. What actual lightness did Lotus instill in a bread and butter hatchback? Not much actually. Engine tuning, suspension tuning and some bodywork. What lightness? Sometimes I think there is too much emphasis on lightness when in actual fact trimmings and luxury fittings are what sells.

That bit was also some thought on Lotus, but for Proton the two cars mentioned above actually showed what a collaboration can achieve. Why can't Lotus and Proton come up with one based on either the Proton Suprima S or even a Proton Perdana (aka previous gen Honda Accord since it now has some rights to produce it in a facelifted rebranded form?).

I imagine a Proton Lotus Suprima S in the mould of the Talbot Sunbeam Lotus with an upgraded 1.6 turbocharged engine with at least 200bhp / 300Nm torque, sportier suspension and a heck of an aggressive bodykit – I'd like Lancia Integrale arches, a fully vented bonnet and a nice whaletail of a rear roof spoiler please, and with proper Recaro seats inside. Produce a limited run of say 5,000 units for some economics of scale and sell it for about RM100,000-110,000. It may sell like crazy. If everything is sorted out, there could be punters from UK and Japan willing to export the cars over there as collectors items.

I also imagine a Lotus Perdana 2.4liter with at least 200bhp for around RM170,000. Make it like the Lotus Carlton, wide arches, nice bodykit, luxury inside and some extra go (not much so that the car stays sensibly priced). This not so much as Proton may need Honda approval to go ahead with such a plan. But not with the Suprima S. That is totally achievable. RM20,000 over the price of the current  Suprima S with a proper Lotus badge in place of the Proton Tiger would make it sell.

What you get is a fantastic Proton Lotus and affordable sporting cars for Malaysians. With a proper heritage filled brand name to boot. Some say that this will dilute the Lotus brand. Honestly what is there to dilute in the first place? Lotus sells 2,000 cars per year if they are lucky and hardly any here in Malaysia. What is there to dilute? If you keep the sales of the Lotus Proton exclusively here in Malaysia what actual dilution you think is being done? Not much I believe. Proton gets a better name  (and not some R3 branded nonsense – it does not seem to be working does it?) and Lotus gets extra sales volume and cash from some development work as well as use of its Lotus trademark. It could use this extra profit to make its revival plan even greater.

I think this is the short term way to go for both Proton and Lotus. One needs a better and bigger name, one needs more sales. Do it properly, both won't suffer. But please make sure that build quality does not suffer. Then both will crash and burn like crazy. I think in this tough and trying times, this branding exercise could be an answer for the short term.

And what of Proton's long term plans? That folks, is a tale for another day.
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Monday, August 19, 2013

Proton Suprima S - Driven.

10:24 PM 0


It's quite a large hatchback isn't it? The newly launched Proton Suprima S looks as big as the Proton Inspira nee Mitsubishi Lancer parked in front of it. Now this is the actual problem that Proton needs to highlight when it comes to launching new cars or variants. I should harp a little about this before we get to the slightly more interesting details about how the Suprima S drives.

Priced from RM76,500 around RM79,988 the Suprima S isn't a cheap Proton. In fact it is slightly cheaper than the Inspira and slightly more expensive than the Proton Preve. It is also more expensive than the Proton Satria R3, which is supposedly Proton's hottest model (which sadly does not come with a turbocharged 1.6liter engine like the Preve and Suprima S). It also sits in the region where one could opt for the cheapest non-Malaysian cars like the hot selling but really big arsed Nissan Almera, the dull Toyota Vios and the slightly better than window dressing Honda City. There are even smaller hatchbacks within the same price range like the Suzuki Swift and the Ford Fiesta. These are world class superminis that are actually the best in their class. 


 And I happen to believe that most Malaysians aren't that patriotic when it comes to car purchases. Those who are 'patriotic' would end up buying the cheaper Persona, Preve as well as a Perodua. The only thing that would happen is that the Suprima would pinch some sales from the higher priced Proton models mentioned herein and maybe, just maybe a smattering of sales from Honda, Nissan, Kia, Toyota buyers. Only if these buyers are drunk, high on ganja or forced to sign the purchase documents at gunpoint. Why so? Ask yourself again....Do you actually know of anyone out there who wouldn't want a Toyota, Honda, Nissan over a Proton? Of course there are some. But not many. Not as many as Proton would want. 

But this does not mean that Proton should pack up and call it a day. If you aren't aware, Proton has thousands of employees and is a catalyst for tens of thousands of other Malaysians (and Bangladeshis, Vietnamese etc) who toil at Proton's supplier plants. These plants and Proton's are growers and movers in the Malaysian economy which in turn adds to the GDP and jobs to a whole lot of Malaysians. This is a good thing. Of course this good thing must be supplemented by the fact that Proton must produce cars that people buy. So are people buying Proton? Yes. Take a look at our roads today. But will people buy an Eighty Thousand Ringgit Hatchback? I'll try to help you make that decision. 

 Proton has launched the Proton Suprima S in two variants. One is priced slightly short of Eighty Thousand Malaysian Ringgit and another about three thousand Ringgit less. In the more expensive car you get stuff like leather seats and steering wheel instead of fabric and plastic, reverse camera instead of no camera, parking sensors all round instead of just the rear, hill assist for the transmission instead of no assistance, 17 inch wheel and tyre combo instead of a 16 inch wheel and tyre combo. If you add up all the items and the cost for each item you could see that it would be impossible for you to buy these items separately for only three thousand Ringgit. What this shows is that the full specced Suprima S is a very good buy. Or you could also say that the car has been overpriced to such an extent that Proton could throw in more goodies than Santa Claus for a measly sum of three thousand Ringgit. Whatever the case, in monthly installments, the extra amount would be negligible. So if you want a Suprima S based on its specs and you are too lazy to read further, buy the full specced version.


I am not going to get into the specifics of the Suprima S. It has tons of equipment and wifi connectivity and a whole lot more impressive features that you could get in a Kia or a Hyundai or any modern sub One Hundred Thousand Ringgit car. The Suprima S has all the goodies you want. Except that inflatable rubber doll of Katy Perry that you'd want to cuddle at night with.

The question that bugged me before test driving the car was whether it deserved a whole new name instead of just being called the Proton Preve Hatchback. After driving the darn thing I have to say that it doesn't. It may have that 'handling by Lotus' badge stuck on the rear ala Proton Satria GTi which the Preve doesn't have but does that warrant a name change? The lack of boot also does not warrant a name change as a lot of cars keep the same name in either version of the car. Of course this is the same syndrome that affected the Proton Persona and the Gen2. Maybe its a Proton thing and we should let it slide. For now.

And so to the driving. It drives decently well. The driving position is similar to the Preve and everything looks and feels the same to me. The leather wrapped steering wheel is a little small compared to most cars these days with the exception of the Peugeot 208 which is go kart small. This one is sporty enough but could be slightly thicker for added grip. The perceived quality of the interior is average. It may have soft touch plastics here and there but the overall shape and design of the dashboard leaves much to be desired. It is too simple to look fashionable or luxurious. But that's about it. Once you press the start button it drives decently well.

The suspension is firm yet supple on broken tarmac. There is little road noise from the tyres and at speeds of around 130km/h little wind noise around the a-pillars that I can tell. The only slightly noisy bit about this car is the drivetrain. It uses a CVT transmission with 7 virtual gears which you can play via the paddleshifts. I basically left it in automatic most of the time as I was a little lazy during the test drive. Hey, I'm lazy. What can I say. The CVT gearbox whines slightly at low speeds but it is actually quieter than the one in the Proton Preve when it first came out. Proton has made some progress here. I still do not like CVTs due to the fact that it will hold a gear at the engine's peak output for rapid progress to be made. This meant that on full song, the Suprima S makes quite a riot. Revs do not climb like a usual torque convertor or a manual gearbox. It just sits at 5,500rpm and you want it scream whilst the speed climbs. I wished Proton added more soundproofing or a sweeter sounding engine. But the Suprima is made to a certain price. You won't get super refinement here. 

It isn't that fast too. 0-100km/h is achieved slightly under 10 seconds. 138bhp and 205 Nm torque isn't all that rapid during acceleration and while being turbocharged and aside from the CVT drivetrain whine and noise at full bore acceleration, the CFE engine isn't that impressive also compared to, say a Peugeot 1.6 turbocharged lump or the one in a VW Golf 1.4. Direct injection and other more expensive goodies make such engines smoother and a little more powerful. Note that the Pug and the VW makes over 240Nm from their engines. I have to say that the engine is adequate and coupled to the efficient CVT, it makes the 1.6liter turbocharged Suprima S pulls well but not impressively well. Its mid-range is pretty good because of this. But if you read the specs, you'd note that the Preve reaches 100km/h faster than the Suprima which is heavier by about 20kgs due to its larger glass area at the rear. So the sportier car isn't the faster car.

But it is sportier though. I believe that the Lotus badge in the rear is put there due to the fact that Proton spent more time tuning the suspension (with Lotus' input) compared to the Preve. The car can corner slightly better than the Suprima sedan...ie Preve. Maybe its the 17inch wheels and tyre combination that made the difference. It is only slightly stiffer in the ride department compared to the Preve. In the slightly wet conditions I drove the Suprima in the front still holds the line very well into a long sweeping corner. In a high speed turn there was no push whatsoever from the front wheels and no scrabbling from the front tyres. The traction control systems that came with the car wasn't intrusive and could be felt only on one occasion when I was flinging the car through some corners which I was familiar with. There was very little understeer and no torque steer. You can actually use the throttle to correct the car mid corner and the car obediently follows. Not much tail wagging, but not much understeer too. It also feels planted at speed yet has a decent ride. The steering may lack some feel but is pretty responsive. You can place the car where you want it without drama. This is a very good thing for enthusiasts. This is Proton's trademark. Good ride and handling. The rest is suspect. 

Pros: good ride, handling, great specs, equipment, tunability, best Proton from Proton and by Proton on sale today.
Cons: noisy drivetrain (too much efficiency can be a bad thing), image issues, price, dull interior design

Cars to consider : Suzuki Swift (big car feel from something smaller), Ford Fiesta (same as the Swift), Proton Preve (it's lighter, faster and cheaper and only slightly less on the handling front...very very very slightly less so), Proton Inspira (nicer interior,its basically a mitsubishi lancer for cheap - cant go wrong with that),  

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Wednesday, August 14, 2013

Proton Suprima photos leaked.

4:36 AM 0
Photos of the Proton Preve hatchback are going around (I've taken this from my friend who got it off the web.). I think there are going to be more Subaru Impreza copies running around. Now its going to be the GRB hatchback version especially in blue pictured herein. Malaysians that cannot afford an Impreza are going to make this their Impreza whether  Subaru, Subaru owners and rational people like it or not. All they would think this car needs is a bonnet scoop and wallah, it's a Subaru. Of course, the new Proton hatch is going to cost somewhat like the Preve - around Rm60,000 to Rm75,000 depending on whether it has a turbocharger or not. (update - there are two versions of the Suprima S. Both turbocharged)

It's also called the  Proton Suprima. Sounds like a brand of Petronas unleaded petrol to me and when i was typing this on the Ipad the autocorrect spelt 'subprime'. hmmmm.....



Anyway, the question will be whether the car will be as supreme as its name. But since it will have the same front end, the same dashboard and interior with the exception of everything backwards of the c-pillars we actually know what's the actual quality of the car. It is going to be the same as the Preve. The only thing that will be slightly different will be the handling due to the lack of a boot at the rear.

Don't quite like the rear lights though. Too small for the car and does not do justice to the rest of the car. Oh well, the Proton design team always seem to stumble of late. Not quite getting the final look complete. If you were to compare this to a Kia Cerato it is super conservative in its design language. Not good Proton....not good at all. The Suprima needs more flair. Proton needs more flair. But please, no Chris Bangle type of designers. The automotive world isn't ready for another 'flame surfaced' monstrosity.

The good points so far that I can predict is the fact that you can get a turbocharged hatchback under RM75,000 with good ride and handling as well as cheap spare parts in the long run. The rest is typically Proton. You figure out if that is bad or good. I sure won't.
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